Breakdown: Simone Biles

Brian Johnson (00:21.855)
Hey, listener, welcome to Talent Chasing, where we bring real world stories from the fields, courts, and the pitches of Major League sports and offices of corporate talent. It's our job to amplify those hidden stories and finding, retaining, and motivating the best talent in the world. Because no team exists, as we know, anywhere without great talent. My name is Brian Johnson. I'm a former Major League Baseball player and scout.

Chad (00:49.408)
I'm Chad Sawash, recruitment industry veteran. And this episode is part of our breakdown series where we literally break down news and topics of our favorite athletes and business icons.

Brian Johnson (01:02.059)
This week's breakdown is focused on the GOAT, Simone Biles. Fresh off her Olympic victories, we're gonna get into her and the things that she stands for.

Chad (01:12.544)
Yeah, that's, that's right, Brian. Simone Biles, the most decorated gymnast in history, the goat, captured the world's attention, not just for her athletic prowess, but for her courage and prioritizing her mental health. After withdrawing from the 2020 Tokyo Olympics due to a mental block known as quote unquote, the twisties Biles became a vocal advocate for mental health awareness.

Now, after two year hiatus, she's returned stronger than ever, concluding her participation in the Paris 2024 Olympics by capturing three golds in a silver. Biles received scathing remarks after withdrawing. Critics said she quote unquote, wasn't tough and that she's a quitter. Now, Brian, you and I thought this was a great topic, not just to show.

the true strength of an individual, Simone Biles, but to demonstrate what strength really is, and that, in a corporate setting, happens as well. It's called getting burnt out. What do you think?

Brian Johnson (02:21.163)
Burnout is such a big deal in my work and working with different companies across every industry and even doing some work around the world, right? It's a common thing that comes up. Why? Because when we've had the recession, right? We had the pandemic. What happened? Companies pulled back. had to remove people, had to fire some people, had to downsize some. And so instead of rehiring those folks when things got better, they have kept the current system as it is.

Chad (02:29.63)
Mm

Brian Johnson (02:50.611)
and forced people who stayed to work twice as long, twice as hard, three times as hard, accounting for three or four people or two or three people. And that contributes to the burnout. And it's just, it's crazy. And you see it all the time, you feel bad for folks, but it's so important, number one, that we acknowledge what's going on and to be able to understand it and be able to speak of it. know, Simone Biles had a tough time speaking about it at first.

I mean, from reading her story, she didn't want to be this advocate for mental health. That wasn't her goal. Her goal is just trying to get through the previous Olympics and try to make it out of there without hurting herself. Because I love how they described it, where the twisties come into play as you mentioned. The twisties come into play and what happens is the gymnast in this scenario is not able to finish or do or concentrate as they're within a twist.

Chad (03:26.622)
No. Yeah.

Brian Johnson (03:48.233)
or within a move or a tumble, whatever it may be. So they lose their focus on where they are. And that leads to crashing. That leads to falls. That leads to serious injury. We watch gymnasts all the time. We're like, my goodness, how on earth did they do that? Their mental's got to be locked into that. And when that's off, she stopped and she was great by stopping.

Chad (04:09.354)
So they equate this to what I'm sure you don't like to talk about, but it's called the yips, right? They, they, they equate this to the yips and, listener, if you, you're out there, you don't know what the yips are. It's, literally a situation where you get into a bad slump. And from a mental standpoint, I want you to talk about this, Brian, cause I, I, I've never been on the professional stage before. Have you ever had the yips? Tell them, talk about the yips.

Brian Johnson (04:15.755)
Yeah, exact same thing.

Brian Johnson (04:37.419)
Yeah, great call. And it's not because of a slump. Interesting enough, what happens is it's just so in baseball, baseball for one as a sport, right? And what we're finding is that it only happens when you have to throw the ball. And usually it's throwing the most simple throws. So Chuck Knobloch was a second baseman for the New York Yankees. He was famous with these, but a whole bunch of Steve Sacks with the Los Angeles Dodgers had it later in his career.

Chad (04:43.956)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.

Chad (04:53.556)
Yeah. Yeah.

Brian Johnson (05:03.201)
So that's the shortest throw on the baseball field is from second baseman to the first baseman. And they mentally can't make the throw. Now back them up and put them back 100 feet. They can make the throw all day. But mentally they can't, putting the information from the brain to the hand to throw that simple short throw, they can't do it. And so catchers that comes and play it real quick. I had an example. We were playing in Atlanta, Georgia. I was with the San Diego Poudres, like maybe my third year as young guy.

Chad (05:22.822)
huh.

Brian Johnson (05:32.833)
They had Chipper Jones and their whole staff, right? Greg Mannix and all those guys during the great days of the Braves. And we're ahead and so the bases are loaded two outs ninth inning. And so I grabbed the ball, I'm catching, I'm about to throw it back to my umpire, my umpire, back to my pitcher. And at that split second, I thought in my head, my God, if I throw this away, we're gonna lose.

Chad (05:41.504)
yeah. Yeah? huh.

Chad (06:02.506)
Ho ho ho!

Brian Johnson (06:03.315)
And I literally thought to myself, my God, this is the yips. This is where it is. And so I was like, forget it. So I picked the ball and just threw it as hard as I can to the guy, to the pitcher, and it went away. And I never had to deal with it again. But for that split second, for that split second, for some reason it didn't stick to me and I was able to get off Monday. But that's what the yips are in baseball.

Chad (06:08.058)
huh.

Chad (06:24.616)
Yeah. Well, I mean, in being able to equate it, think for, for guys, right? You see, you see Simone Biles, you never heard of the twisties before. can't imagine being six, eight feet up in the air, you know, doing all these twists and turns. mean, just it's amazing what they do, but being able to equate it to something that you might've actually felt in sports. Now I've felt that before, but again, not on the kind of stage that you have or Simone Biles has. And that to me would even, I mean, that would

just increase the yips or the twisties so much more, because you have those many eyes on you. And from a mental standpoint, wow, what kind of pressure.

Brian Johnson (07:05.845)
Yeah, and how do you get out of it? mean, baseball wise, we haven't figured it out yet. We have not. It sounds like Simone Biles figured it out. She she went to weekly counseling. She was able to work it through there from the mental standpoint, because in baseball, whenever we hear about the Ips, it's always, you know, step with your opposite foot first or do this or do that. It's all physical stuff. So I'm fascinated by what she did. And she did. I haven't heard. I haven't read any details as to what exactly she did mentally.

Chad (07:16.916)
Mm -hmm.

Brian Johnson (07:33.429)
but it sounds like the mental piece was able to help her overcome it, which is fantastic.

Chad (07:38.9)
So I've had the yips as a sales guy. I've had the yips on stage, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. When I was first starting to actually do presentations, I mean, I do them all the time now, so it's really easy, but you go through the process of what if somebody in here thinks I'm full of shit? Or what if I, I mean, and that is literally, it gives you the anxiety.

Brian Johnson (07:42.165)
Mmm, really.

Brian Johnson (07:46.197)
Really?

Brian Johnson (08:06.337)
What if I forget what I'm gonna say? Yeah.

Chad (08:08.126)
Yeah. Yeah. What if I forget what's going on? You know, so when you're in a sales call in the middle of a sales call and everything just leaves your brain or you're in a pitch and everything leaves your brain or you're on stage. So I've had that before in the corporate setting. And I think it's really important for people to understand that, you know, yes, athletes with all of these cameras and eyes and things on them, it happens.

But it also happens with people who are under high stress types of jobs and they've been stretched too thin as you said before. Companies, instead of re -staffing up, they're stretching their people too thin, they're getting burnt out and these types of things will happen. Not to mention, you know, I think it was about

18 months or so ago, a letter was leaked outside of Amazon. was an internal memo that actually showed that they were losing $8 billion due to attrition. $8 billion. that was not allowing them to actually create the $8 billion in revenue that they could have because they were losing so many people. So it is incredibly important to understand

Brian Johnson (09:14.016)
Mmm.

Chad (09:28.602)
in obviously sports as a business, don't get me wrong, but in business every day that we understand that the yips are there, burnout is there, and we have to first and foremost take care of our people because if we're not taking care of our people, that's a big problem. I want to kind of pivot here real quick. I'm to go into kind of double standard real quick. In Paris Olympics,

There was this new thing called the repashage right and the repashage actually allowed individuals who did not qualify To come back and try again. Okay, so I'd like to kind of call out that double standard really quick because in Paris When they did the repashage in the men's 400 repashage rounds there were four heats where 26 athletes got another bite at the Olympic Apple

Eight of those 26 did not start, which means they opted out of the entire race. Didn't even try. So first and foremost, did you know that? Did you hear about that?

Brian Johnson (10:37.717)
I did not hear about it at all. didn't even know that existed.

Chad (10:41.226)
So eight male athletes chose not to take the opportunity for, for a second chance. I knew because I was watching it. One of those heats, there were three dudes because four did not start. Right. We didn't hear about this. Now the media covered Simone Biles withdrawal. Why are we not hearing about this? And again, I challenge the guys that are out there, not to mention also the women.

to start to think about these things from a double standard standpoint, right? Because corporate America does the exact same thing. We treat women unfairly. When professional women take maternity leave and they don't come back immediately, they're seen as entry level again. Even though they have experience, they just took a break, right? It's one of the many reasons that even though the US demographics are roughly 51 % female, only 10

10 10 % of those CEO roles of fortune 500 companies are filled by female leaders So again as we're taking a look at this on the corporate side Got the yips you got the burnout, but we also have a double double standard and fairness. What are your thoughts on this? This is this is right down your lane

Brian Johnson (12:02.047)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. mean, again, see that all the time. And what happens is that the organization suffers because you have a different perspective, a different wiring that comes from women as compared to men. Having both of them is so valuable and you get different looks at the same problem or same issue or more creativity, right? From a different standpoint, it just makes no sense as to why it is.

Chad (12:10.228)
Yes.

Brian Johnson (12:31.051)
though that way, right? But you know, and I use this all the time when I when I do some of our sessions is that look, I remember a time when it was it was said and accepted to be truth that black players were not capable of being quarterbacks in the NFL. They weren't smart enough. They weren't starting to be head coaches. So therefore that's why you don't see him. Same thing when I was growing up. Women weren't strong enough to be leaders, weren't strong enough to do this, to do that. They weren't athletic enough to do this or do that.

Chad (12:32.426)
Mm -hmm.

Brian Johnson (13:00.575)
All those things are gone. And so it pushes us to rethink what we were taught and to rethink what was always kind of assumed and always was kind of written in stone. Nothing's written in stone. We should reevaluate how we're hiring. Do we really need a four year degree to do this? Is this really something that a woman can't do? Is this really something that we need here? And when we reevaluate, we get better.

Chad (13:23.146)
Mm -hmm.

Yeah. I remember I was in the infantry and I remember having a conversation with one of my friends. I'd been under fire during Panama and I remember somebody asking me, know, what would you think about having a female in the foxhole with you? I said, first and foremost, last thing I'm thinking about when I'm under fire is having sex. Okay. Okay. Number one and number two, can she pick my injured

ass up and carry me out of there, carry me or get me medical help or do what they need to do. Right. I don't care. Can they do the job? And I think that is one of the things that again, from a double standard standpoint, we really haven't focused on.

Brian Johnson (14:12.491)
Yeah, and back to your double standards point, You were thinking the same thing, I'm sure, in the foxhole in the time of battle, that the little motherfucker that's a guy over there, gotta be able to pick me up and take me out of here too. But we don't talk about that. That only comes into play when we discuss whether our women should be able to fight on the front lines. The dudes should be held to the same standard as well.

Chad (14:15.338)
Hmm?

Chad (14:23.294)
Hahaha

Yes. Yeah.

Chad (14:33.813)
Yes.

Chad (14:37.514)
That's exactly right. Well, I want to finish this episode out, very first episode of breaking things down with something that's positive and it's actually a dude. Okay? So take a listen.

Chad (15:01.888)
Okay, we'll try that again because the sound was down. Okay, take a listen.

Chad (15:51.786)
So I think we could prospectively be getting there. You've got a, and again, this is not in the US, but it is in Australia. You've got somebody who is live on TV, live, right? Giving the weather and says, you know what, I'm having a panic attack. I'm going to have to hand it over. And then he has a peer who automatically receives that with empathy, with empathy in the workplace. That's the workplace right there.

in the workplace takes over says, I gotcha. Right. That to me is a great model to be able to look at. And, was just great to be able to see that happen on air. Not that he was having a panic attack, but that he had support, not to mention listeners and viewers also support.

Brian Johnson (16:43.797)
Yeah, I love that. I had read about the highlights or the headlines about it, but hadn't really seen or heard the video or audio until you played it. And yeah, that was the thing that jumped out at me the most. I love the support that he got and I love that he was honest about it. Same thing with the Simone Biles piece. For me, I'm attracted to humility. I'm attracted to the human qualities that we all have. Those things are attractive in a leader.

Chad (16:49.658)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.

Brian Johnson (17:11.851)
Those things are attractive in a peer or a teammate. I want that person on my team. You know what mean? And I think those are powerful messages that we're getting. you know, honestly, let's stay out of the Twitter sphere and X or whatever. That's just a cesspool of people throwing out, hiding behind their computers and just throwing daggers out and not caring who they hit. And that's just not a healthy place to be. So.

For me, I don't hang out in that space because that's not the kind of food I want for my head, for my brain. I want stuff like that. The positive stuff where we're embracing each other, we're showing each other love and support, and that's how we get stronger right there.

Chad (17:47.999)
Yeah.

Chad (17:54.993)
Mm

Yeah. Well, a quick breakdown. I don't know if you know or not, but Elon's lost 90 % value in, the 44 billion that he's, he spent on X. So who knows how much longer the cesspool is going to be around. but listener, tell you what, thanks again for sticking with us, and enjoying, and joining us for this very first session of breakdown. We're definitely, I don't know, maybe we'll break down Elon Musk. Maybe we'll bring down, break down Andy Jassy.

Brian Johnson (18:24.351)
Ha

Chad (18:26.708)
Who knows, but we look forward to more time with you and Brian, thanks again for coming on my friend.

Brian Johnson (18:34.241)
Thanks a lot. Thanks everybody.

Chad (18:36.35)
Later.